A lot of voices will be needed to battle supermarket giant

First published in Letters

I RECENTLY attended a meeting of the Salisbury Area Board.

My reason for attendance - and for that of a number of members of the public there - was because the developers behind the proposed building of a Sainsbury's superstore off Southampton Road were giving a presentation of their revised plans.Not one member of the public or the council at that meeting expressed support for the proposals.

On the contrary, there were cogent and at times impassioned objections.

These objections were unanimous in their reasoning.

"We don't object to a new Sainsbury's store - just not in that location!"

Some people even resorted to begging the developers to look for another site.

Clearly the revised plans, supposedly answering the concerns about the traffic congestion and building on a floodplain, were cutting no mustard with the citizens of Salisbury.

The developers made it clear that only if the Highways Agency and the Department of the Environment vetoed their proposals would they withdraw their plans.

The overwhelming opinion of the citizens of Salisbury may affect some small details of the plan but would not in the end be a deciding factor. So much for democracy.

At the time I was deeply affected by the strength and conviction of the objections voiced by the people of Salisbury at that meeting.

But afterwards the only words that echoed in my mind were those of the developers: “We are committed to this site. It is the only site available to compete on an equal basis with Tesco.”

So there you have it.

That is why Sainsbury's want to build their superstore on a floodplain, on an impossibly busy road.

It's going to need a lot of us to raise our voices in order to be heard over the roar of the battle between the supermarket giants, and even then our voices may well count for nothing.

One thing I do know. If they do go ahead and build their store in that location here is one customer who will never cross their threshold. Care to join me, anyone?

Sylvia Barnard, Salisbury

TO conserve or not to conserve? That is the question.

Firstly, if I remember rightly, it was the conservationists at the time who managed to persuade the powers that be at the time to stop the building of the Salisbury bypass on the grounds that it would spoil the water meadows.

The answer to the question is: should the conservationists of this time now be campaigning for the development of a food store to be stopped?

Secondly, if this plan does go ahead perhaps Sainsbury’s could be persuaded to build the bypass, or at least give a considerable grant towards the cost, because this development is inevitably going to increase traffic and cause complete chaos all over Salisbury - let alone the extra flooding - and all they will do is dance to the sound of ringing tills.

So come on conservationists, where are you? Salisbury needs you again, but this time with a more practical stance – stopping a development that will have dire affects on the infrastructure of Salisbury as a whole, unlike the benefits of a bypass.

Jenny Gee, Winterslow

Comments (20)

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2:23pm Wed 26 Mar 14

mazclarke says...

I too recently attended a meeting about this development and there was no-one in favour of it there either. Sadly though they will get it through as they will not listen to the public.
They do not seem to understand that there is no need for another supermarket in this area. They say that there will be no increase in traffic as 50% of the shoppers using Sainsbury's will be transferring from Tescos! I am not sure how Tesco would feel about that comment as I am sure they have already lost a large percentage to Lidl.
They do not care about the impact on the A36 because there will be a lead off lane into Sainsbury's! Really and this will alleviate the traffic how?? None of their reasoning makes sense, I did tell them they needed to live in Alderbury and try getting in and out of town within a reasonable timescale but they don't want to know.
I really hope that this does not go ahead & if it does I may as well give up trying to get to town, I certainly will not be shopping in Sainsbury's
I too recently attended a meeting about this development and there was no-one in favour of it there either. Sadly though they will get it through as they will not listen to the public. They do not seem to understand that there is no need for another supermarket in this area. They say that there will be no increase in traffic as 50% of the shoppers using Sainsbury's will be transferring from Tescos! I am not sure how Tesco would feel about that comment as I am sure they have already lost a large percentage to Lidl. They do not care about the impact on the A36 because there will be a lead off lane into Sainsbury's! Really and this will alleviate the traffic how?? None of their reasoning makes sense, I did tell them they needed to live in Alderbury and try getting in and out of town within a reasonable timescale but they don't want to know. I really hope that this does not go ahead & if it does I may as well give up trying to get to town, I certainly will not be shopping in Sainsbury's mazclarke
  • Score: 7

5:40pm Wed 26 Mar 14

journalist1 says...

Here is everyone's chance to do something about this absurd scheme. Sign the petition (link below) and also express your opinion in the survey (the second link below)

https://www.change.o
rg/petitions/sainsbu
ry-s-stop-sainsbury-
s-southampton-road-p
lans-for-salisbury

https://www.surveymo
nkey.com/s/RZCBQ8T
Here is everyone's chance to do something about this absurd scheme. Sign the petition (link below) and also express your opinion in the survey (the second link below) https://www.change.o rg/petitions/sainsbu ry-s-stop-sainsbury- s-southampton-road-p lans-for-salisbury https://www.surveymo nkey.com/s/RZCBQ8T journalist1
  • Score: 1

6:32pm Wed 26 Mar 14

Richard Clewer says...

We have launched a petition to suggest Sainsbury's think about a different location as highlighted above.

We will be meeting outside the Guildhall this Saturday to start collecting signatures. Please do come along then. If anyone wants copies of the petition to help collect signatures please get in touch with me at richard.clewer@wilts
hire.gov.uk
We have launched a petition to suggest Sainsbury's think about a different location as highlighted above. We will be meeting outside the Guildhall this Saturday to start collecting signatures. Please do come along then. If anyone wants copies of the petition to help collect signatures please get in touch with me at richard.clewer@wilts hire.gov.uk Richard Clewer
  • Score: 4

11:20am Fri 28 Mar 14

karlmarx says...

Yet the expansion and development north of the city is currently supermarket-less. All these extra journeys along the A36 and ring road equals more traffic congestion and more pollution. Surely the decision to block this insane proposal of another supermarket on the Southampton Road is a no brainer. Common sense alone should persuade whichever council/quango that has to make the decision to reject these proposals. Why should the poor old public have to get up in arms again over an obvious impending fiasco/carbuncle.
Yet the expansion and development north of the city is currently supermarket-less. All these extra journeys along the A36 and ring road equals more traffic congestion and more pollution. Surely the decision to block this insane proposal of another supermarket on the Southampton Road is a no brainer. Common sense alone should persuade whichever council/quango that has to make the decision to reject these proposals. Why should the poor old public have to get up in arms again over an obvious impending fiasco/carbuncle. karlmarx
  • Score: 2

12:56pm Fri 28 Mar 14

Richard Clewer says...

Karl, it is not a quango that will make the decision but the Southern planning commitee. They (along with any potential inspector who may hear any appeals) will make the decision based on planning evidence.

By gathering a survey showing where people want to see a new Supermarket and a petition showing people don't want it on that site we gather evidence which under the localism act should have an impact on the decision.

Instead of being sarky please get as many people as possible to sign the petition and fill in the survey.

I will not be taking part in any Southern Area Planning commitee looking at this issue as I do not have an open mind on it, I oppose it.
Karl, it is not a quango that will make the decision but the Southern planning commitee. They (along with any potential inspector who may hear any appeals) will make the decision based on planning evidence. By gathering a survey showing where people want to see a new Supermarket and a petition showing people don't want it on that site we gather evidence which under the localism act should have an impact on the decision. Instead of being sarky please get as many people as possible to sign the petition and fill in the survey. I will not be taking part in any Southern Area Planning commitee looking at this issue as I do not have an open mind on it, I oppose it. Richard Clewer
  • Score: -2

2:28pm Fri 28 Mar 14

UKD003 says...

I am for the store to be built in the proposed location. We need another store and location is fine. I was not able to attend the board meeting. Competition will benefit us all.

To be fair and balanced, can you please let me know where the petition is to build the store can be found?
I am for the store to be built in the proposed location. We need another store and location is fine. I was not able to attend the board meeting. Competition will benefit us all. To be fair and balanced, can you please let me know where the petition is to build the store can be found? UKD003
  • Score: -6

5:18pm Fri 28 Mar 14

Williamson45 says...

Wiltshire Council has a EIA Screening Opinion for Asda Foodstore at Salisbury Retail Park, London Road, Bishopdown.
A supermarket on this land which has stood unused for about 20 years with the sign 'Salisbury Retail Park' would serve the existing 500 houses there, the 500 being built there and would relieve traffic through Laverstock and the Southampton Road.
We need a supermarket to the north of the city.
Register your comments here by 4th April:

http://planning.wilt
shire.gov.uk/Northga
te/PlanningExplorer/
PLComments.aspx?pk=7
55940
Wiltshire Council has a EIA Screening Opinion for Asda Foodstore at Salisbury Retail Park, London Road, Bishopdown. A supermarket on this land which has stood unused for about 20 years with the sign 'Salisbury Retail Park' would serve the existing 500 houses there, the 500 being built there and would relieve traffic through Laverstock and the Southampton Road. We need a supermarket to the north of the city. Register your comments here by 4th April: http://planning.wilt shire.gov.uk/Northga te/PlanningExplorer/ PLComments.aspx?pk=7 55940 Williamson45
  • Score: 5

5:29pm Fri 28 Mar 14

Richard Clewer says...

UKD003, if you want to set up a petition to build the store go for it. That is not one I am going to setup myself.

The Survey however is designed to ask if people are in favour of the site or not and where in Salisbury they think a supermarket could be built. You can make your point there. I am hoping that will give some evidence (under the localism agenda) to help in the planning process.

https://www.surveymo
nkey.com/s/RZCBQ8T
UKD003, if you want to set up a petition to build the store go for it. That is not one I am going to setup myself. The Survey however is designed to ask if people are in favour of the site or not and where in Salisbury they think a supermarket could be built. You can make your point there. I am hoping that will give some evidence (under the localism agenda) to help in the planning process. https://www.surveymo nkey.com/s/RZCBQ8T Richard Clewer
  • Score: 2

5:47pm Fri 28 Mar 14

karlmarx says...

You would expect common sense to have some influence on any decision being made. Points for the 'Southern Planning Committee' to consider.
Traffic congestion
Flooding
Footnote: I don't recall voting in a Southern Planning committee, still, it's nice to know they will be voting on my behalf, for the wrong decision.
I have signed all the petitions against this fiasco!
You would expect common sense to have some influence on any decision being made. Points for the 'Southern Planning Committee' to consider. Traffic congestion Flooding Footnote: I don't recall voting in a Southern Planning committee, still, it's nice to know they will be voting on my behalf, for the wrong decision. I have signed all the petitions against this fiasco! karlmarx
  • Score: -4

7:05pm Fri 28 Mar 14

Richard Clewer says...

Planning is a quasi judicial process. That means it has to follow fixed rules about how decision are made. For example the Councillors on a committee have got to have an open mind to the arguments put forward by all sides. All decisions must be made on planning grounds and not other grounds.

To assume that the committee will make the 'wrong' decision is just crazy. It will make a decision when the planning application gets to it based on the planning evidence. I will not participate as I can't say I have an open mind on this issue, I think it is a lunatic idea.

What is more concerning is that if the Southern Planning committee turn the application down then Sainsbury's can appeal to an un-elected planning inspector.

I was very pleased when the coalition government said it would get rid of the inspectorate. I am much less pleased when several years later they have done nothing but strengthen the planning inspectorate.
Planning is a quasi judicial process. That means it has to follow fixed rules about how decision are made. For example the Councillors on a committee have got to have an open mind to the arguments put forward by all sides. All decisions must be made on planning grounds and not other grounds. To assume that the committee will make the 'wrong' decision is just crazy. It will make a decision when the planning application gets to it based on the planning evidence. I will not participate as I can't say I have an open mind on this issue, I think it is a lunatic idea. What is more concerning is that if the Southern Planning committee turn the application down then Sainsbury's can appeal to an un-elected planning inspector. I was very pleased when the coalition government said it would get rid of the inspectorate. I am much less pleased when several years later they have done nothing but strengthen the planning inspectorate. Richard Clewer
  • Score: -1

10:17pm Fri 28 Mar 14

nesspah says...

I would have thought that the Wiltshire Council Strategic Planning Committee would be assessing this because the director will have received many public representations.

I seem to remember that only one person from Salisbury sits on that committee.

And what's that rubbish I just read above - make a decision ........ based on the planning evidence - have you met the Sainsbury estates development consultants !!
I would have thought that the Wiltshire Council Strategic Planning Committee would be assessing this because the director will have received many public representations. I seem to remember that only one person from Salisbury sits on that committee. And what's that rubbish I just read above - make a decision ........ based on the planning evidence - have you met the Sainsbury estates development consultants !! nesspah
  • Score: 1

11:56pm Fri 28 Mar 14

Richard Clewer says...

I have been told by the head of planning that it is almost certain that Southern Planning will hear the application.

I have met the planning consultants from Sainsbury's, on several occasions now. No matter how slick they are the committee will base its decision on planning evidence. I sit on the committee and can assure you that is how decisions are made.
I have been told by the head of planning that it is almost certain that Southern Planning will hear the application. I have met the planning consultants from Sainsbury's, on several occasions now. No matter how slick they are the committee will base its decision on planning evidence. I sit on the committee and can assure you that is how decisions are made. Richard Clewer
  • Score: -3

8:22am Sat 29 Mar 14

UKD003 says...

I am beginning to see what is going on here.....

Why demonise Sainsbury? They are not the real problem. The council is diverting the focus off of them onto Sainsbury.

The council has failed to address the real issue which is to fix the road. It is well known and nothing has been done. Progress and competition should not be sacrificed.

So my thoughts are if the Sainsbury build prevented, the real problem continue to go on as is, without critical action.
I am beginning to see what is going on here..... Why demonise Sainsbury? They are not the real problem. The council is diverting the focus off of them onto Sainsbury. The council has failed to address the real issue which is to fix the road. It is well known and nothing has been done. Progress and competition should not be sacrificed. So my thoughts are if the Sainsbury build prevented, the real problem continue to go on as is, without critical action. UKD003
  • Score: 4

9:18am Sat 29 Mar 14

Richard Clewer says...

Sadly the Council has quite literally nothing to do with southampton road. It is run by and maintained by the highways agency.

I did ask Council Staff to intervene when the road started flooding recently. We did some gully cleaning and pumping when it was clear that the highways agency were not about to act.

The only group that can do anything about the A36 including fix potholes or improve traffic flow is the Highways agency.

It took me 2 years to get a small pothole fixed on the ringroad section when it normally takes a couple of days and I had to use the threat of the Journal to get that done. I have reported potholes along much of the ringroad length. I would urge everyone to do the same. It may force the Highways agency to acknowledge there are issues in the City to resolve.

Back to Southampton Road, I got a chap from the Highways Agency to come to the Area Board a few years ago. He said he would go away and look at the isuses involved and report back on options. We never heard anything again despite trying to contact him for over a year.
Sadly the Council has quite literally nothing to do with southampton road. It is run by and maintained by the highways agency. I did ask Council Staff to intervene when the road started flooding recently. We did some gully cleaning and pumping when it was clear that the highways agency were not about to act. The only group that can do anything about the A36 including fix potholes or improve traffic flow is the Highways agency. It took me 2 years to get a small pothole fixed on the ringroad section when it normally takes a couple of days and I had to use the threat of the Journal to get that done. I have reported potholes along much of the ringroad length. I would urge everyone to do the same. It may force the Highways agency to acknowledge there are issues in the City to resolve. Back to Southampton Road, I got a chap from the Highways Agency to come to the Area Board a few years ago. He said he would go away and look at the isuses involved and report back on options. We never heard anything again despite trying to contact him for over a year. Richard Clewer
  • Score: 3

9:56pm Sun 30 Mar 14

Williamson45 says...

Richard Clewer wrote:
Sadly the Council has quite literally nothing to do with southampton road. It is run by and maintained by the highways agency.

I did ask Council Staff to intervene when the road started flooding recently. We did some gully cleaning and pumping when it was clear that the highways agency were not about to act.

The only group that can do anything about the A36 including fix potholes or improve traffic flow is the Highways agency.

It took me 2 years to get a small pothole fixed on the ringroad section when it normally takes a couple of days and I had to use the threat of the Journal to get that done. I have reported potholes along much of the ringroad length. I would urge everyone to do the same. It may force the Highways agency to acknowledge there are issues in the City to resolve.

Back to Southampton Road, I got a chap from the Highways Agency to come to the Area Board a few years ago. He said he would go away and look at the isuses involved and report back on options. We never heard anything again despite trying to contact him for over a year.
I remember this highways guy coming from Bristol to speak at the area board. It was obvious that he had never seen Southampton Road, let alone understand its problems. What a waste of a journey from Bristol that was!
[quote][p][bold]Richard Clewer[/bold] wrote: Sadly the Council has quite literally nothing to do with southampton road. It is run by and maintained by the highways agency. I did ask Council Staff to intervene when the road started flooding recently. We did some gully cleaning and pumping when it was clear that the highways agency were not about to act. The only group that can do anything about the A36 including fix potholes or improve traffic flow is the Highways agency. It took me 2 years to get a small pothole fixed on the ringroad section when it normally takes a couple of days and I had to use the threat of the Journal to get that done. I have reported potholes along much of the ringroad length. I would urge everyone to do the same. It may force the Highways agency to acknowledge there are issues in the City to resolve. Back to Southampton Road, I got a chap from the Highways Agency to come to the Area Board a few years ago. He said he would go away and look at the isuses involved and report back on options. We never heard anything again despite trying to contact him for over a year.[/p][/quote]I remember this highways guy coming from Bristol to speak at the area board. It was obvious that he had never seen Southampton Road, let alone understand its problems. What a waste of a journey from Bristol that was! Williamson45
  • Score: 0

6:17am Tue 1 Apr 14

karlmarx says...

Williamson45 wrote:
Richard Clewer wrote:
Sadly the Council has quite literally nothing to do with southampton road. It is run by and maintained by the highways agency.

I did ask Council Staff to intervene when the road started flooding recently. We did some gully cleaning and pumping when it was clear that the highways agency were not about to act.

The only group that can do anything about the A36 including fix potholes or improve traffic flow is the Highways agency.

It took me 2 years to get a small pothole fixed on the ringroad section when it normally takes a couple of days and I had to use the threat of the Journal to get that done. I have reported potholes along much of the ringroad length. I would urge everyone to do the same. It may force the Highways agency to acknowledge there are issues in the City to resolve.

Back to Southampton Road, I got a chap from the Highways Agency to come to the Area Board a few years ago. He said he would go away and look at the isuses involved and report back on options. We never heard anything again despite trying to contact him for over a year.
I remember this highways guy coming from Bristol to speak at the area board. It was obvious that he had never seen Southampton Road, let alone understand its problems. What a waste of a journey from Bristol that was!
Ironically he must have used the A36 to get to Salisbury.
Maybe the people who are responsible for the Southampton Road, The highways Agency, would also take a dim view of the developers whose irresponsible plan will have serious consequences for the Highways Agencies agenda.
Quote:
"Our role is to help support the sustainability of the UK’s economy by operating, maintaining and improving the strategic road network in England on behalf of the Secretary of State for Transport.
The strategic road network in England is some 4,300 miles long and is made up of motorways and trunk roads - the most significant ‘A’ roads. While our network represents only two per cent of all roads in England by length, it carries a third of all traffic by mileage. Significantly, two thirds of all heavy goods vehicle mileage in England is undertaken on the strategic road network, making it the economic back bone of the country."

Methinks Sainsburys ambitions will be getting in the way of the economic backbone of the country.

Can't really see the Environment Agency supporting a plan to build on a floodplain either but, you never know these days.
[quote][p][bold]Williamson45[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Richard Clewer[/bold] wrote: Sadly the Council has quite literally nothing to do with southampton road. It is run by and maintained by the highways agency. I did ask Council Staff to intervene when the road started flooding recently. We did some gully cleaning and pumping when it was clear that the highways agency were not about to act. The only group that can do anything about the A36 including fix potholes or improve traffic flow is the Highways agency. It took me 2 years to get a small pothole fixed on the ringroad section when it normally takes a couple of days and I had to use the threat of the Journal to get that done. I have reported potholes along much of the ringroad length. I would urge everyone to do the same. It may force the Highways agency to acknowledge there are issues in the City to resolve. Back to Southampton Road, I got a chap from the Highways Agency to come to the Area Board a few years ago. He said he would go away and look at the isuses involved and report back on options. We never heard anything again despite trying to contact him for over a year.[/p][/quote]I remember this highways guy coming from Bristol to speak at the area board. It was obvious that he had never seen Southampton Road, let alone understand its problems. What a waste of a journey from Bristol that was![/p][/quote]Ironically he must have used the A36 to get to Salisbury. Maybe the people who are responsible for the Southampton Road, The highways Agency, would also take a dim view of the developers whose irresponsible plan will have serious consequences for the Highways Agencies agenda. Quote: "Our role is to help support the sustainability of the UK’s economy by operating, maintaining and improving the strategic road network in England on behalf of the Secretary of State for Transport. The strategic road network in England is some 4,300 miles long and is made up of motorways and trunk roads - the most significant ‘A’ roads. While our network represents only two per cent of all roads in England by length, it carries a third of all traffic by mileage. Significantly, two thirds of all heavy goods vehicle mileage in England is undertaken on the strategic road network, making it the economic back bone of the country." Methinks Sainsburys ambitions will be getting in the way of the economic backbone of the country. Can't really see the Environment Agency supporting a plan to build on a floodplain either but, you never know these days. karlmarx
  • Score: 1

1:31pm Tue 1 Apr 14

gingin says...

When the Core Strategy was drawn up why was such a huge development to the north of the City allowed to be passed without space for a supermarket? As I understand things there are a couple of options for a Cemetery and one is outside of the development so why not a supermarket on one of these sites?

Is there some planning reason why a supermarket could not be built for this development?
When the Core Strategy was drawn up why was such a huge development to the north of the City allowed to be passed without space for a supermarket? As I understand things there are a couple of options for a Cemetery and one is outside of the development so why not a supermarket on one of these sites? Is there some planning reason why a supermarket could not be built for this development? gingin
  • Score: 2

9:38am Thu 3 Apr 14

pdiddie says...

Quite simply if Sainsburys do get planning permission for their Southampton Road project, then it will surely be conclusive proof that County and local councils are in the pockets of developers. I must try to get on the council to earn some 'expenses' to supplement my pension!
Asda in London Road is good, even better for both the people living to the west/Wilton side of Salisbury and to ease traffic congestion across the city would be a superstore on the UKLF development site.
Quite simply if Sainsburys do get planning permission for their Southampton Road project, then it will surely be conclusive proof that County and local councils are in the pockets of developers. I must try to get on the council to earn some 'expenses' to supplement my pension! Asda in London Road is good, even better for both the people living to the west/Wilton side of Salisbury and to ease traffic congestion across the city would be a superstore on the UKLF development site. pdiddie
  • Score: 0

9:52am Thu 3 Apr 14

pdiddie says...

On the point of 'healthy competition' being good for shoppers if Sainsbury open in Southampton road, this is nonsense. Tesco and Sainsburys will have some short term price promotions over the opening period, but will soon return to their normal pricing structure. I know because I worked in the industry for 40 years.The traffic chaos will immediately negate any savings in the stores anyway!
On the point of 'healthy competition' being good for shoppers if Sainsbury open in Southampton road, this is nonsense. Tesco and Sainsburys will have some short term price promotions over the opening period, but will soon return to their normal pricing structure. I know because I worked in the industry for 40 years.The traffic chaos will immediately negate any savings in the stores anyway! pdiddie
  • Score: 0

8:33pm Wed 16 Apr 14

beaser says...

Sainsburys have done their ground work here,they know this is a prime area & will attract customers from far & wide.
To be honest Asda & Sainsburys will be built ,big business is powerfull.

.Am I being naughty here, cash donation to Labour,Oh next government Labour & hey hoe new Sainsburys on Soton road.
Sainsburys have done their ground work here,they know this is a prime area & will attract customers from far & wide. To be honest Asda & Sainsburys will be built ,big business is powerfull. .Am I being naughty here, cash donation to Labour,Oh next government Labour & hey hoe new Sainsburys on Soton road. beaser
  • Score: 0

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