Highest paid council employee earns 11.2 times the wage of the lowest

THE highest-paid employee at Wiltshire Council earns 11.2 times the wages of the lowest, a new report shows.

The council’s annual pay policy statement shows that the highest-paid earns £139,000 compared with the lowest, who earn the full-time equivalent of £12,435.

Two corporate directors at Wiltshire Council are listed on its website as earning between £138,000 and £143,000. These are Carlton Brand and Maggie Rae.

The figures mean the ratio is within the guidelines of the Hutton Review of Fair Pay in the Public Sector, which recommended that the highest paid person should earn no more than 20 times the lowest.

The pay policy statement was set to be discussed by the staffing policy committee yesterday (January 8) along with a proposal for the council to adopt the hourly Living Wage rate, which is currently £7.65 per hour.

This was proposed by Councillor Jeff Osborn, an Independent member, who said he was pleased it was being considered. Cllr Osborn, who has been a stern critic of pay and allowances increases for top officers and Cabinet members, said of the Living Wage: “If finally adopted, it will reduce some of the inequality between the lowest and highest salaries on Wiltshire Council.”

The pay policy statement, which covers 5,000 staff and not the 7,800 council employees working in schools, shows the average salary is £23,991.

The statement says pay for the 85 top jobs at the council, which was reviewed last year, is at the “median market rate”. New employees may also receive help with “relocation expenses” and non-senior employees regularly working unsocial hours can be paid allowances of up to 33 per cent.

Pay increases are nationally negotiated, although trade unions are consulted locally about travel expenses, overtime and grading.

During the summer, the council ran a voluntary redundancy programme in which 252 frontline staff left the organisation.

Seven of the council’s 18 associate directors also took voluntary redundancy, while the remaining associate directors saw their wages rise on average by 7.5 per cent.

Comments (20)

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3:20pm Tue 7 Jan 14

karlmarx says...

"the lowest, who earn the full-time equivalent of £12,435."

Is it possible to survive on £12,435?
Rent, mortgage, council tax, gas, electric, water, food, clothing, travel, insurance etc... Surely they would need to be on some form of benefits?

Making work pay?
"the lowest, who earn the full-time equivalent of £12,435." Is it possible to survive on £12,435? Rent, mortgage, council tax, gas, electric, water, food, clothing, travel, insurance etc... Surely they would need to be on some form of benefits? Making work pay? karlmarx

5:08pm Tue 7 Jan 14

Grampie says...

The average salary of a Wiltshire Council employee is £23,991.

That is not as much as our MP John Glen claims for accommodation, gas electricity, council tax and travel.

That is in addition to his £63,000+ a year salary.

He is a very nice chap, by the way.
The average salary of a Wiltshire Council employee is £23,991. That is not as much as our MP John Glen claims for accommodation, gas electricity, council tax and travel. That is in addition to his £63,000+ a year salary. He is a very nice chap, by the way. Grampie

5:32pm Tue 7 Jan 14

blackstone says...

karlmarx wrote:
"the lowest, who earn the full-time equivalent of £12,435."

Is it possible to survive on £12,435?
Rent, mortgage, council tax, gas, electric, water, food, clothing, travel, insurance etc... Surely they would need to be on some form of benefits?

Making work pay?
Some of us pensioners live on a lot less than that,,,with no benefits
[quote][p][bold]karlmarx[/bold] wrote: "the lowest, who earn the full-time equivalent of £12,435." Is it possible to survive on £12,435? Rent, mortgage, council tax, gas, electric, water, food, clothing, travel, insurance etc... Surely they would need to be on some form of benefits? Making work pay?[/p][/quote]Some of us pensioners live on a lot less than that,,,with no benefits blackstone

7:02pm Tue 7 Jan 14

Champers says...

Interesting. I have worked for WC. for the last 12 years on a salary not much above minimum wage. They have now discovered that they have been overpaying me a few pennies extra for the last 7 years. Not an overpayment that I could have even been expected to notice as it is so small but they have now written requesting it is returned or they will start deducting it from my salary with immediate effect.
Interesting. I have worked for WC. for the last 12 years on a salary not much above minimum wage. They have now discovered that they have been overpaying me a few pennies extra for the last 7 years. Not an overpayment that I could have even been expected to notice as it is so small but they have now written requesting it is returned or they will start deducting it from my salary with immediate effect. Champers

7:35pm Tue 7 Jan 14

Schoolmum999 says...

Has anyone ever done the same calculation for Salisbury Hospital? I am guessing that the gap is wider. Plus, don't forget any salary the senior managers may receive from subsidiary companies etc.
Has anyone ever done the same calculation for Salisbury Hospital? I am guessing that the gap is wider. Plus, don't forget any salary the senior managers may receive from subsidiary companies etc. Schoolmum999

9:11pm Tue 7 Jan 14

brandx says...

The comment by Champers having his pay docked is most interesting.

If Wiltshire Council on its 4th February meeting has any guts it will dock the increase in Members' Allowances - Jane Scott getting an extra 36% - and restore some sense. As its, this massive increase for the Leader and her Cabinet has destroyed all trust between Wiltshire Council and the public. No wonder politics is held in such contempt..

The petition calling for resignation of Leader and Cabinet is still out there.

Sign it.
The comment by Champers having his pay docked is most interesting. If Wiltshire Council on its 4th February meeting has any guts it will dock the increase in Members' Allowances - Jane Scott getting an extra 36% - and restore some sense. As its, this massive increase for the Leader and her Cabinet has destroyed all trust between Wiltshire Council and the public. No wonder politics is held in such contempt.. The petition calling for resignation of Leader and Cabinet is still out there. Sign it. brandx

1:03am Wed 8 Jan 14

karlmarx says...

blackstone wrote:
karlmarx wrote:
"the lowest, who earn the full-time equivalent of £12,435."

Is it possible to survive on £12,435?
Rent, mortgage, council tax, gas, electric, water, food, clothing, travel, insurance etc... Surely they would need to be on some form of benefits?

Making work pay?
Some of us pensioners live on a lot less than that,,,with no benefits
I'm amazed at how you do it, you have my respect for being able to survive on such a pittance, one of the lowest state pensions in Europe.

Here are the facts that confirm this:

Britain’s pension shame: UK state pensions are the LOWEST in Europe - and even Slovenia and Slovakia give their old people more
Pensioners in the UK are entitled to a maximum of £110.15 per-week
Report says that is almost £70 below what is a 'living state pension'
Nations such as Slovenia, Hungary and Slovakia offer more generous deals
Salary replaced by UK pension is 32.6%, compared to 67.9% in Slovakia.

Apparently Scameron has vowed to keep the state pension at this derisory level if he wins the next general election, that sounds like a vote winner, not.
[quote][p][bold]blackstone[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]karlmarx[/bold] wrote: "the lowest, who earn the full-time equivalent of £12,435." Is it possible to survive on £12,435? Rent, mortgage, council tax, gas, electric, water, food, clothing, travel, insurance etc... Surely they would need to be on some form of benefits? Making work pay?[/p][/quote]Some of us pensioners live on a lot less than that,,,with no benefits[/p][/quote]I'm amazed at how you do it, you have my respect for being able to survive on such a pittance, one of the lowest state pensions in Europe. Here are the facts that confirm this: Britain’s pension shame: UK state pensions are the LOWEST in Europe - and even Slovenia and Slovakia give their old people more Pensioners in the UK are entitled to a maximum of £110.15 per-week Report says that is almost £70 below what is a 'living state pension' Nations such as Slovenia, Hungary and Slovakia offer more generous deals Salary replaced by UK pension is 32.6%, compared to 67.9% in Slovakia. Apparently Scameron has vowed to keep the state pension at this derisory level if he wins the next general election, that sounds like a vote winner, not. karlmarx

7:28am Wed 8 Jan 14

Colmanskid says...

karlmarx wrote:
blackstone wrote:
karlmarx wrote:
"the lowest, who earn the full-time equivalent of £12,435."

Is it possible to survive on £12,435?
Rent, mortgage, council tax, gas, electric, water, food, clothing, travel, insurance etc... Surely they would need to be on some form of benefits?

Making work pay?
Some of us pensioners live on a lot less than that,,,with no benefits
I'm amazed at how you do it, you have my respect for being able to survive on such a pittance, one of the lowest state pensions in Europe.

Here are the facts that confirm this:

Britain’s pension shame: UK state pensions are the LOWEST in Europe - and even Slovenia and Slovakia give their old people more
Pensioners in the UK are entitled to a maximum of £110.15 per-week
Report says that is almost £70 below what is a 'living state pension'
Nations such as Slovenia, Hungary and Slovakia offer more generous deals
Salary replaced by UK pension is 32.6%, compared to 67.9% in Slovakia.

Apparently Scameron has vowed to keep the state pension at this derisory level if he wins the next general election, that sounds like a vote winner, not.
karlmarx I see you have quoted Hungary as having a better pension than the UK, but Hungary does not have any form of Disability Pension and are currently raising along with other Eurpoean countries their retirement age which was 62 to a figure align with others. Also they have dropped unemployment Benifit from 9 to 3 months only. But they punish couples who have no children and they get less pension than a couple who bring up 3 children. Anybody fancy moving to Hungary?
[quote][p][bold]karlmarx[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]blackstone[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]karlmarx[/bold] wrote: "the lowest, who earn the full-time equivalent of £12,435." Is it possible to survive on £12,435? Rent, mortgage, council tax, gas, electric, water, food, clothing, travel, insurance etc... Surely they would need to be on some form of benefits? Making work pay?[/p][/quote]Some of us pensioners live on a lot less than that,,,with no benefits[/p][/quote]I'm amazed at how you do it, you have my respect for being able to survive on such a pittance, one of the lowest state pensions in Europe. Here are the facts that confirm this: Britain’s pension shame: UK state pensions are the LOWEST in Europe - and even Slovenia and Slovakia give their old people more Pensioners in the UK are entitled to a maximum of £110.15 per-week Report says that is almost £70 below what is a 'living state pension' Nations such as Slovenia, Hungary and Slovakia offer more generous deals Salary replaced by UK pension is 32.6%, compared to 67.9% in Slovakia. Apparently Scameron has vowed to keep the state pension at this derisory level if he wins the next general election, that sounds like a vote winner, not.[/p][/quote]karlmarx I see you have quoted Hungary as having a better pension than the UK, but Hungary does not have any form of Disability Pension and are currently raising along with other Eurpoean countries their retirement age which was 62 to a figure align with others. Also they have dropped unemployment Benifit from 9 to 3 months only. But they punish couples who have no children and they get less pension than a couple who bring up 3 children. Anybody fancy moving to Hungary? Colmanskid

10:20am Wed 8 Jan 14

Richard Clewer says...

Karl I am interested to see you condemn the lowest level of pay in the Council as being far too low to live on (A statement I would agree with).

You also condemn Councillors for the recent pay increase. The basic pay for a Councillor is now £12,289 per year (in reality the lowest paid role in the Council but apparantly as it is an allowance it does not count in the figures).

Is it all right for Councillors to be paid at a level where they would be getting working tax credits but not other council staff?
Karl I am interested to see you condemn the lowest level of pay in the Council as being far too low to live on (A statement I would agree with). You also condemn Councillors for the recent pay increase. The basic pay for a Councillor is now £12,289 per year (in reality the lowest paid role in the Council but apparantly as it is an allowance it does not count in the figures). Is it all right for Councillors to be paid at a level where they would be getting working tax credits but not other council staff? Richard Clewer

2:46pm Wed 8 Jan 14

karlmarx says...

Richard Clewer wrote:
Karl I am interested to see you condemn the lowest level of pay in the Council as being far too low to live on (A statement I would agree with).

You also condemn Councillors for the recent pay increase. The basic pay for a Councillor is now £12,289 per year (in reality the lowest paid role in the Council but apparantly as it is an allowance it does not count in the figures).

Is it all right for Councillors to be paid at a level where they would be getting working tax credits but not other council staff?
If that was their only source of income then I would agree but, on checking councillors profiles that is not the case. Interestingly when Wiltshire council wielded the axe and asked for voluntary redundancies, how many councillors fell on their swords?
None.
[quote][p][bold]Richard Clewer[/bold] wrote: Karl I am interested to see you condemn the lowest level of pay in the Council as being far too low to live on (A statement I would agree with). You also condemn Councillors for the recent pay increase. The basic pay for a Councillor is now £12,289 per year (in reality the lowest paid role in the Council but apparantly as it is an allowance it does not count in the figures). Is it all right for Councillors to be paid at a level where they would be getting working tax credits but not other council staff?[/p][/quote]If that was their only source of income then I would agree but, on checking councillors profiles that is not the case. Interestingly when Wiltshire council wielded the axe and asked for voluntary redundancies, how many councillors fell on their swords? None. karlmarx

3:01pm Wed 8 Jan 14

karlmarx says...

Colmanskid wrote:
karlmarx wrote:
blackstone wrote:
karlmarx wrote:
"the lowest, who earn the full-time equivalent of £12,435."

Is it possible to survive on £12,435?
Rent, mortgage, council tax, gas, electric, water, food, clothing, travel, insurance etc... Surely they would need to be on some form of benefits?

Making work pay?
Some of us pensioners live on a lot less than that,,,with no benefits
I'm amazed at how you do it, you have my respect for being able to survive on such a pittance, one of the lowest state pensions in Europe.

Here are the facts that confirm this:

Britain’s pension shame: UK state pensions are the LOWEST in Europe - and even Slovenia and Slovakia give their old people more
Pensioners in the UK are entitled to a maximum of £110.15 per-week
Report says that is almost £70 below what is a 'living state pension'
Nations such as Slovenia, Hungary and Slovakia offer more generous deals
Salary replaced by UK pension is 32.6%, compared to 67.9% in Slovakia.

Apparently Scameron has vowed to keep the state pension at this derisory level if he wins the next general election, that sounds like a vote winner, not.
karlmarx I see you have quoted Hungary as having a better pension than the UK, but Hungary does not have any form of Disability Pension and are currently raising along with other Eurpoean countries their retirement age which was 62 to a figure align with others. Also they have dropped unemployment Benifit from 9 to 3 months only. But they punish couples who have no children and they get less pension than a couple who bring up 3 children. Anybody fancy moving to Hungary?
UK STATE pensions are different to allowances people receive for their disabilities obviously. As for the UK stance on disability allowance you only have to read the news to see how this government are trying to mimic the Hungarian system....

"How Atos comes under pressure to declare disabled people as fit for work
A leaked report shows 97% of people undergoing its assessment are 'expected' to recover within two years. Ask Atos, the company responsible for executing the work capability assessment (WCA), or the Department for Work and Pensions, which defines how the WCA is conducted, and they will tell you that they have no targets for the number of people who pass. Yet a new report from the Centre for Welfare Reform, How Norms Become Targets, uses a leaked set of Atos data to suggest that the DWP is holding Atos to extremely tight tolerances on its results."

And again, with the STATE pension the goal STD are being moved...

"State pension age to be raised to 70 for today's young workers
George Osborne will use autumn statement to signal new formula linked to life expectancy that could save £500bn over 50 years"

Maybe this generation of abandoned youngsters might take up the offer of retiring at 65 instead of 70?
[quote][p][bold]Colmanskid[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]karlmarx[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]blackstone[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]karlmarx[/bold] wrote: "the lowest, who earn the full-time equivalent of £12,435." Is it possible to survive on £12,435? Rent, mortgage, council tax, gas, electric, water, food, clothing, travel, insurance etc... Surely they would need to be on some form of benefits? Making work pay?[/p][/quote]Some of us pensioners live on a lot less than that,,,with no benefits[/p][/quote]I'm amazed at how you do it, you have my respect for being able to survive on such a pittance, one of the lowest state pensions in Europe. Here are the facts that confirm this: Britain’s pension shame: UK state pensions are the LOWEST in Europe - and even Slovenia and Slovakia give their old people more Pensioners in the UK are entitled to a maximum of £110.15 per-week Report says that is almost £70 below what is a 'living state pension' Nations such as Slovenia, Hungary and Slovakia offer more generous deals Salary replaced by UK pension is 32.6%, compared to 67.9% in Slovakia. Apparently Scameron has vowed to keep the state pension at this derisory level if he wins the next general election, that sounds like a vote winner, not.[/p][/quote]karlmarx I see you have quoted Hungary as having a better pension than the UK, but Hungary does not have any form of Disability Pension and are currently raising along with other Eurpoean countries their retirement age which was 62 to a figure align with others. Also they have dropped unemployment Benifit from 9 to 3 months only. But they punish couples who have no children and they get less pension than a couple who bring up 3 children. Anybody fancy moving to Hungary?[/p][/quote]UK STATE pensions are different to allowances people receive for their disabilities obviously. As for the UK stance on disability allowance you only have to read the news to see how this government are trying to mimic the Hungarian system.... "How Atos comes under pressure to declare disabled people as fit for work A leaked report shows 97% of people undergoing its assessment are 'expected' to recover within two years. Ask Atos, the company responsible for executing the work capability assessment (WCA), or the Department for Work and Pensions, which defines how the WCA is conducted, and they will tell you that they have no targets for the number of people who pass. Yet a new report from the Centre for Welfare Reform, How Norms Become Targets, uses a leaked set of Atos data to suggest that the DWP is holding Atos to extremely tight tolerances on its results." And again, with the STATE pension the goal STD are being moved... "State pension age to be raised to 70 for today's young workers George Osborne will use autumn statement to signal new formula linked to life expectancy that could save £500bn over 50 years" Maybe this generation of abandoned youngsters might take up the offer of retiring at 65 instead of 70? karlmarx

3:33pm Wed 8 Jan 14

karlmarx says...

"The council’s annual pay policy statement shows that the highest-paid earns £139,000"

And while we are being distracted by the low pay issue look what is being missed. How on Earth can anyone survive in these days of austerity on merely £2,673 per week? It must be a real struggle. Still, we're all in this together as you can see.
"The council’s annual pay policy statement shows that the highest-paid earns £139,000" And while we are being distracted by the low pay issue look what is being missed. How on Earth can anyone survive in these days of austerity on merely £2,673 per week? It must be a real struggle. Still, we're all in this together as you can see. karlmarx

9:10pm Wed 8 Jan 14

Champers says...

I agree Karl. Also, one has to feel sorry for footballers and media ''personalities' too. It must be SO hard to exist on the sort of salaries they're on. I know bankers et al should be held accountable but I do get slightly hacked off with Bono, Bob G, Terry Wogan asking us all to donate to charity when they are being paid astronomical amounts and just to give up a days wage would make little difference to their lifestyles.

Sorry, I know I've hijacked this thread but we are talking about inequality in pay.
I agree Karl. Also, one has to feel sorry for footballers and media ''personalities' too. It must be SO hard to exist on the sort of salaries they're on. I know bankers et al should be held accountable but I do get slightly hacked off with Bono, Bob G, Terry Wogan asking us all to donate to charity when they are being paid astronomical amounts and just to give up a days wage would make little difference to their lifestyles. Sorry, I know I've hijacked this thread but we are talking about inequality in pay. Champers

8:28pm Thu 9 Jan 14

sherbuenbus says...

ABSOLUTLY DISGUSTING
NOW YOU KNOW WHERE THE COUCIL TAX GOES
EVERYONE SHOULD PUT IN FOR A REDUCTION IN COUNCIL TAX
ABSOLUTLY DISGUSTING NOW YOU KNOW WHERE THE COUCIL TAX GOES EVERYONE SHOULD PUT IN FOR A REDUCTION IN COUNCIL TAX sherbuenbus

8:48pm Thu 9 Jan 14

jayrose says...

Champers: how do you know whether or not the sports and media personalities you mention give their time or money to charitable causes?
many of them do a great deal of good work in the community which is not reported on.
Champers: how do you know whether or not the sports and media personalities you mention give their time or money to charitable causes? many of them do a great deal of good work in the community which is not reported on. jayrose

10:01pm Thu 9 Jan 14

karlmarx says...

jayrose wrote:
Champers: how do you know whether or not the sports and media personalities you mention give their time or money to charitable causes?
many of them do a great deal of good work in the community which is not reported on.
As do those whose salary is a pittance but, never the less, find the time and energy to do what they can for those even less fortunate. It's easy to pontificate from the top of a pile of gold coins, much harder when you are swimming in a cesspit.
[quote][p][bold]jayrose[/bold] wrote: Champers: how do you know whether or not the sports and media personalities you mention give their time or money to charitable causes? many of them do a great deal of good work in the community which is not reported on.[/p][/quote]As do those whose salary is a pittance but, never the less, find the time and energy to do what they can for those even less fortunate. It's easy to pontificate from the top of a pile of gold coins, much harder when you are swimming in a cesspit. karlmarx

10:10pm Thu 9 Jan 14

karlmarx says...

Today's news should help then. From our famous towel folder...

George Osborne cautious on 'self-defeating' minimum wage rises

Chancellor George Osborne has warned that "self-defeating" increases to the minimum wage could "cost jobs".


Here in Wiltshire we don't have this problem with the minimum wage. We have the problem of £19,000 pay hikes, 35% allowance increases for those NOT on the minimum wage which does "cost jobs" 500 or so last year.
Still, there's always the £7,600, 11% pay hike that Osborne and co' can look forward to, let's see how many jobs that costs. My estimate? Nil.
Today's news should help then. From our famous towel folder... George Osborne cautious on 'self-defeating' minimum wage rises Chancellor George Osborne has warned that "self-defeating" increases to the minimum wage could "cost jobs". Here in Wiltshire we don't have this problem with the minimum wage. We have the problem of £19,000 pay hikes, 35% allowance increases for those NOT on the minimum wage which does "cost jobs" 500 or so last year. Still, there's always the £7,600, 11% pay hike that Osborne and co' can look forward to, let's see how many jobs that costs. My estimate? Nil. karlmarx

2:13am Fri 10 Jan 14

karlmarx says...

On the subject of putting things into context like wages. How about some of the wildly inaccurate claims being made by the current Secretary of State for Work and Pensions IDS being put into context as well?

Perhaps Iain Duncan Smith and his DWP spinners would benefit from some context. The £1.1 billion cost of fraud (a modest 0.7% of the total benefits spend) averages out to £59 across 18.5 million claimants.* In contrast, MPs were ordered to pay back £1.2 million in the wake of Thomas Legg’s inquiry into expenses, an average of £1,858 for the 646 members of the Commons.
*5.7 million working age claimants plus 12.8 million pension age claimants. Source: DWP Quarterly Statistics Summary


£59 in the real world versus £1,858 in Parliament. So, who gets the punishment and who gets the reward?

The £59 per person gets cuts and taxed
The £1,858 per person gets £7,600 per annum reward
Justice, where did that go?
On the subject of putting things into context like wages. How about some of the wildly inaccurate claims being made by the current Secretary of State for Work and Pensions IDS being put into context as well? Perhaps Iain Duncan Smith and his DWP spinners would benefit from some context. The £1.1 billion cost of fraud (a modest 0.7% of the total benefits spend) averages out to £59 across 18.5 million claimants.* In contrast, MPs were ordered to pay back £1.2 million in the wake of Thomas Legg’s inquiry into expenses, an average of £1,858 for the 646 members of the Commons. *5.7 million working age claimants plus 12.8 million pension age claimants. Source: DWP Quarterly Statistics Summary £59 in the real world versus £1,858 in Parliament. So, who gets the punishment and who gets the reward? The £59 per person gets cuts and taxed The £1,858 per person gets £7,600 per annum reward Justice, where did that go? karlmarx

11:16am Fri 10 Jan 14

karlmarx says...

Latest news

Friday 10th January 2014

Congratulations to our newest City Councillor Patricia Fagan! Fantastic news and a great start to 2014! Salisbury Labour Candidate Patricia Fagan.

Well done Patricia, it's nice to see yet another lady councillor, congratulations!
Latest news Friday 10th January 2014 Congratulations to our newest City Councillor Patricia Fagan! Fantastic news and a great start to 2014! Salisbury Labour Candidate Patricia Fagan. Well done Patricia, it's nice to see yet another lady councillor, congratulations! karlmarx

10:04am Sat 11 Jan 14

gingin says...

karlmarx wrote:
jayrose wrote:
Champers: how do you know whether or not the sports and media personalities you mention give their time or money to charitable causes?
many of them do a great deal of good work in the community which is not reported on.
As do those whose salary is a pittance but, never the less, find the time and energy to do what they can for those even less fortunate. It's easy to pontificate from the top of a pile of gold coins, much harder when you are swimming in a cesspit.
Absolutely, there are many highly paid footballers who don't give their time and money to good causes. Those who are paid a pittance understand only too well how some are struggling.

Perhaps the bad mouthing and disgraceful attitude from footballers on the pitch should be a priority and any fines given to needy causes. These people are idols for the fans so better conduct and respect on the field of play would not go amiss!!
[quote][p][bold]karlmarx[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]jayrose[/bold] wrote: Champers: how do you know whether or not the sports and media personalities you mention give their time or money to charitable causes? many of them do a great deal of good work in the community which is not reported on.[/p][/quote]As do those whose salary is a pittance but, never the less, find the time and energy to do what they can for those even less fortunate. It's easy to pontificate from the top of a pile of gold coins, much harder when you are swimming in a cesspit.[/p][/quote]Absolutely, there are many highly paid footballers who don't give their time and money to good causes. Those who are paid a pittance understand only too well how some are struggling. Perhaps the bad mouthing and disgraceful attitude from footballers on the pitch should be a priority and any fines given to needy causes. These people are idols for the fans so better conduct and respect on the field of play would not go amiss!! gingin

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